Friday, March 14, 2014

Big discoveries in I-P37.2 tree

(Click on tree to enlarge--if you are having problems seeing everything, maybe try downloading it (with right click then save maybe) and then open the tree)

The relationships of the major branches of I-P37.2 are now known. These five branches and their nicknames:
M26  (Sardinian)
M423 (Dinaric, Disles, Isles)
L1286 (Alpine and L233 Western)
L880 (Northern France)
L1294 (France)

The key SNPs that show the history of these branches are:
CTS595,  S21825, and  L1286. The importance of each of these was learned in a different way:
CTS595 was included in the Geno 2.0 test
S21825 was included in the Chromo2 test at and their chief scientist Jim Wilson released 2000 anonymous results in January. Ken Nordtvedt compared these results. See the most recent Chromo2P37 tree at Ken's website.
Finally, L1286 was discovered back in 2012 in a WTY (Walk Thorough the Y) by Thomas and Astrid Krahn back when they were at Family Tree DNA. For a long time we thought that only the Alpine and the I-L233 Western groups were L1286+, but then Zdenko Markovic noticed that not all I-P37.2 groups had tested it, and it turned out that the I-L880 "Northern France" group is also L1286+.

We used the nicknames "Sardinian" "Dinaric" etc. for many years because in many cases no SNPs were known to define the branches. For example, there were a few men with P37.2+ M26- M42- L233- results who all had a distinctive pattern of STR markers including DYS388=9. Many of the men had paternal origins from France (but others from Germany, Britain etc), so haplogroup I expert Ken Nordtvedt called the group P37.2*-"France" just to have an easy way to refer to the group.

Now all of the major groups have their own defining SNP and most of the subgroups do too. But very few of these SNPs are on the ISOGG tree. Zdenko Markovic joined the FTDNA I2a Project as co-administrator in January, and began coordinating the P37.2 part of the ISOGG tree at the same time. Thanks to his efforts several SNPs in the M423 area have been added to the ISOGG tree, and so has L880, and he's working on many more additions.


  1. Wanted to ask where is the M359.2/P41.2 branch? Has it been taken out as private, or under some other alias?
    Just realised I have 7 relatives I2a2a on 23andMe, which is the M359.2/P41.2 there and 35 I2a2b, which is the Dinaric branch.
    It seems it is not so rare on the Balkans, only few people from that area are tested for that SNP.

  2. Zdenko and I omited M359.2/P41.2 from the tree because we have never seen a M359.2+/P41.2+ result except in scientific publications. If you want to include this SNP, based on these publications and the current ISOGG tree it should be directly below M423, a third branch of I-M423 along with I-L621 and I-L161. It seems very likely that I-P41.2 is a subgroup of I-L621 but no one has ever tested for this as far as I know.

    There are enough scientific studies that find P41.2+ that I think it should be in the tree.

    I have noticed for a coupple years at least that 23andMe seems to call some people I2a2a but I think it's very unlikely that they are P41.2+. Please check their value for this SNP if if you find anyone with i4000110=C or i4000190=C then they are M359.2+/P41.2+. If they have T, not genotyped, or a no call for these result there is no reason to think they are M359.2+/P41.2+

  3. I am seeing several people in 23andMe's Relative Finder listed as paternal haplogroup I2a2a and my best guess is that they are I-L161. If you can make contact with any of your I2a2a relatives please check their alleles as described above.

  4. I2a2a is defined at 23andMe, if you look at the "Haplotree mutation mapper" as:

    I2a2a defining mutations
    variant call anc der
    i4000110 (M359) T C
    i4000190 (P41.2) T C

    Furthermore, some of my relatives I2a2a, which are not anonymous are coming forme Greece and Moldova, so it is unlikely they are Isles. I think Isles are I2a2 only on 23andMe as they don't test for L161.
    If you are a member of 23andMe, please look into that thread:

  5. Unfortunately, those branded I2a2a by 23andMe are not M359.2/P41.2+.
    It seems to be the new designation of I2a-Dinaric for those tested with chip version

  6. Hey to all :)
    I am from Balkan (Croatia-Hercegovina)
    My haplo gourp is I2b2 - I-P37.2
    I am tall and good lucking :) hehe
    Hope more people will do DNA testing