As a reminder, I-L161 is a major branch of I-P37, and many years ago Ken Nordtvedt gave this branch the nickname "Isles" because it is especially characteristic of Great Britain and Ireland. But we always knew that there were a few I-L161 men in continental Europe. Thanks to several Big Ys, we know that there are two fundamental branches of I-L161:
I-Y13338 which includes men with paternal ancestry from Thrace (Bulgaria/European Turkey), Germany, Poland, Cuba, and southern Iraq. These men were part of Ken's Isles-B cluster
I-S2639, which is much larger and includes all the I-L161 men with ancestry from Britain and Ireland, and it also includes a few men with German, Polish and French-Canadian ancestry. All of Ken's Isles-A, Isles-C and Isles-D clusters belong to I-S2639, and most of his Isles-B cluster also belongs to I-S2639. Probably the name "Isles" is best applied to I-S2639, not I-L161 as a whole.
There are many branches of I-S2639 and they are all found in Britain and Ireland, the fundamental branches are:
I-Y12072 which includes Isles-A (I-PF4135) and relatives, strictly British/Irish according to current knowledge
I-L1498, subbranch I-A1150, includes Isles-B3, Isles-B5 and others in Isles-B, strictly British/Irish according to current knowledge
I-L1498, subbranch I-A10028, a very rare branch with only two known families, one from Scotland or northern England, the other is likely from Ireland. These families had been placed in Isles-B
I-L1498, subbranch I-S2703. This is the largest branch by far and includes all of Isles-C and Isles-D, Isles-B1 and Isles-B4, and others in Isles-B.
As far as we know, the continental European ancestry men in I-S2639 all belong to rather downstream branches of I-S2703 that are almost exclusively British and Irish, for example there are some French Canadian men who belong to the Isles-D2 branch which has a estimated common ancestor who lived 1750 years ago, and Isles-D2 is overwhelmingly Irish and British. And Isles-D2 itself is closely related to other strictly Irish/British branches like Isles-C and others. (Isles-D2 is known by several different names: I-Y4665, I-Y4660 etc).
Based on more than 40 Big Ys, YFull.com calculates that I-S2639 had a common ancestor who lived approximately 6700 years ago, with a relatively strong expansion at the earliest period. Given all of this evidence, I think this is strong evidence that the common ancestor of I-S2639 dates from approximately the initial arrival of I-S2639 in the British Isles, and evidence that I-S2639 has had a continuous presence in the British Isles for the last 6700 years. I don't know of any other Y-DNA haplogroup that might have been in Britain and Ireland for such a long period. (**see update at bottom of this post)
Here are some of the major updates to the I-L161 tree:
We have done some analysis of the BAM file for the I-Y13338 man from southern Iraq and he is ancestral for Y13331 and Y13335. He is not yet on the YFull tree. At this point there are no other known members of his branch and no likely candidates, we will keep looking. Despite these two SNP differences, he is a typical member of I-Y13338. The Polish/German branch is slightly more closely related to the Thracian branch, and the Iraq branch more distant, but all three known branches diverged at approximately the same time, around 4000 years ago.
The I-L161 tree also shows some updates to the I-Y12072 section. From BAM files we now know that Y14359 and Y13904 are currently equivalent SNPs, and both are only found in the Driscoll family, and in extremely closely related men who probably has a Driscoll ancestor a few hundred years ago. There are now three fundamental branches of I-PF4135 (Isles-A), and all three branches have representation in County Cork, Ireland, which suggests a possible "Out of Cork" expansion of this group 1000+ years ago, which reached Scotland, England and the Isle of Man.
Click here to download a pdf version of the May 2017 draft tree for I-L161
We have now placed I-S2703 in a tree of its own for improved legibility.
We continue to learn more about the large Isles-C (I-Y5450) and Isles-D2 (I-Y4665) branches. Each of these branches has a large presence in central-western Ireland, and maybe had a rapid expansion to other parts of Britain and Ireland over 1,000 years ago. All the other branches on the I-S2703 tree are less common.
Click here to download a pdf version of the May 2017 draft tree for I-S2703
Click here for our earlier tree from February 2017
Update May 11, 2017: Ken Nordvedt had another group that he nicknamed "Isles": I-M284 which is part of I-M223 (I-M223 is currently called I2a2a at the ISOGG tree). When I look at the YFull.com tree for I-M284 (click here) I see that almost all of I-M284 belongs to I-L1195 which has a MRCA of 5600 years ago. I think I-L1195 also has good evidence for a continuous presence in Britain and Ireland for approximately 5600 years. But is I-M284 as a whole of British and Irish origin? It seems possible, and I-M284 has a MRCA of 7200 years ago.
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